Hello everybody, and it is your favorite time of the day.
It's another Putin's podcast pops and I could not be more excited about today's conversation.
I would like to welcome in Mr. Paul Epp.
He is a technology entrepreneur and he is here to give a little bit of voice to his voice.
Haha, you will get that pun in a couple of seconds.
Paul, welcome.
How are you today?
Fantastic.
Thanks for having me.
Glad to be here.
Absolutely couldn't be more excited to have you join us on the pop.
I called you a technology entrepreneur, and I made a pun ish type thing about your voice.
So can you go ahead and just give us a little bit of background and kind of introduce yourself to everybody?
Absolutely.
Um.
So, yeah, I, uh, trained to be a musician years ago.
Um, I studied music, a couple of music degrees.
Um, along with that came a lot of teaching music to others and especially kids.
And because they're the most, uh, frequent learners of music, not that anyone is, um.
Can't do that as well.
Um, so I began working with a lot of kids through music and, um, eventually produced a couple of albums of children's music.
Um, gave lots of private lessons.
I was in the classroom in public schools for a couple of years, um, and just took a, an interest in kids and.
Different ways to help them.
Of course.
There are many ways.
Um, I ended up going to business school a few years later and, um, right outta business school I had been working on a project at a business incubator that, um.
It was a project, it was a technology that had had come to the incubator and I had ended up doing most of the research and so, uh, market research on this product.
And so in 2014, um, we started a software company, um, called Foster Care Technologies.
That was based on an a algorithm.
That was meant to help kids in foster care, uh, find the right families.
Um, so Fast Forward, ran that company for about nine years.
Um, it sold in 2023 to another company, uh, one, a social services agency, large, much larger company.
And I worked for them for a couple of years.
And, um.
In the past few months, I have been working with a company about a year almost called Voice, VOIS s.org.
Um, and that's what I'm here to talk about today.
They have a strong virtual reality component and um, very interesting technology and, um, I've really enjoyed getting to know the technology and learn much more about VR from you and from others.
Um.
So that's just sort of a quick history of how I got to where I am today and why we're talking.
Fascinating about the music.
I did not understand the depth of that.
And I do.
Just a quick side question.
Uh, do you play instruments and or do you do any singing?
'cause the only chink in this otherwise perfect armor that is Shannon, is that I can't sing.
And I know that and unfortunately I, 'cause I would've been amazing at musical theater 'cause I got like the personality.
Um, and everything, but I can't, so is it, is it music as in instruments or do you sing A little bit of both.
Uh, well, we can fix the singing right now, Shannon.
We can go through it and give you a lesson right here on the podcast if you want, but you won't want to take it from me.
I, I, I, I, I actually had a lot of musicians in my family.
I, I, I say that I can match pitch.
I don't really sing.
Um, I was a trumpet player, primarily professionally speaking.
Um.
Really more of a composer, arranger, um, these days.
And I, uh, use the piano as a writing tool mostly.
So no serious pianist would call me a pianist, but I do love playing the piano as well.
Oh, that's interesting.
That's also a bold statement too because, um, if I wanted to lose listeners, we could try having me sing.
Um, and you could try teaching me, but I can harmonize better with, with males as well.
And just super really quick story could just 'cause I think it's hilarious in fourth grade, uh, Mrs.
North our, our.
Choreo choir teacher, you could try out to be like if you were a soprano and you wanna be an alto, whatever, you know.
And so I go to get up there and she was this little four foot, you know, 10 inch woman and had the biggest chest I'd ever seen and just that, just this little thing.
And I go to get up there and I walk out onto the stage and she starts laughing.
She's like, child, you're the deepest voice we've got in the choir.
And, um, and, and this is in Syracuse, New York, so I don't know where her southern accent accent came from, but she did.
And it was like the most traumatizing thing for a fourth grade girl, um, to be the deepest voice in the choir.
So I did that, not, I just kind of lip synced from then on.
But yeah.
Thank you Mrs. North.
I am sure she's listening.
Hope she
Yeah, exactly.
Um, but anyways, yes, back to voice.
Uh, that was a nice little detour.
I I love those.
It, it's fun when you learn about people.
Um, but, uh, so you've, you've mentioned this voice and can you give us a little bit more information about what exactly it is?
Sure voice.
Again, it's voice.org VOIS s.org.
It is a platform to help kids learn social skills.
Um.
Very simply, we deliver it a variety of different ways.
There are mobile apps.
We have a v vr headset, uh, version of the application.
But it's essentially a bunch of scenarios that were developed to help kids learn social skills.
Um, we focus a lot on kids with autism.
We focus a lot on kids who have social skilled deficits.
But, um.
You know, one of my interests is to expand how voice can be used, because most of us have some kind of social skill deficit, depending on your definition of social skills.
Um, but this is what was so interesting to me about the product.
Um, back up for a second.
This product came out of two research projects actually at the University of Kansas.
Um, Dr. Sean Smith and Dr. Amber Rolland, um, were two of the core inventors on this product, and you'll see them mentioned on the website.
Um, I came in to help them about a year ago to help turn this into a commercial grade product.
Um, so there are years of research that have gone into this.
They have, uh, created.
A variety of, of these scenarios, um, that really boiled down to, uh, a training environment that helps kids learn these skills that many of us take for granted.
Um.
And that's what it does, and we're just trying to get it out to as many people as we can, um, figure out the business model.
Um, we're well on our way for that Voice is now officially for sale.
Um, and so we are excited to announce that, but also just excited to, we've talked to a lot of folks and we have putting a team together of the different people who can help us.
You know, turn this into a business that sustains itself, reaches lots and lots of people, and continues to develop into, um, something that will hopefully last a really long time.
I love the sound of that, and especially as an educator who taught the multimodal communication classroom, which was, uh, originally designed for students who, uh, were non, who struggled to orally communicate, but were not deaf.
ESP because there's a massive difference in deaf ed and non deaf ed.
And then of course, I had deaf students as well, but, um.
The communication aspect is, is something that's incredibly personal to me and, and close to my heart.
And, you know, a lot of technology was used and things like that.
And, and seeing some of the different products and everything that are out there and how they're utilized.
Is this something that's meant to be, you know, customizable?
Is this like, you know, kind of standard scenarios?
How exactly does it help, you know, reach people for different situations?
So the, the customization aspect.
Very good question.
Glad you asked it, that that's really the key component of any product of this type, I believe, because you need a certain amount of standardization.
You know, here's the skill.
Everybody knows what it means to make eye contact.
Um, there may be variations of that, but that's the core skill.
And then the customization component is what allows us to reach.
Lots and lots of kids in lots of, lots of ways.
Again, I'm, this can be for anyone.
I'm using kids as just the sort of the standard for anyone using voice.
Um, so we have basically, the researchers have identified these skills and we continue to hear more from teachers when we talk to them about how they're using it.
We've piloted it several times in many, many different classrooms.
Um.
And so what we have is this environment where we can take a skill and we can turn it into a scenario and we can label it properly so that we can begin
to measure what's happening and we can measure progress and or the educators or parents or whoever is administering this tool can measure that and.
Through the magic of artificial intelligence, which is this new iteration, um, you may not be surprised to hear, uh, for voice as many products are doing this.
Um, these large language models have opened up this world.
Uh.
That we never had before.
Um, to where it can, we can customize that learning experience for kids who have different styles.
They may have different repetition cadences that they require.
They may have, um, you know, different ways of bringing them back to the scenario that the large language model.
Um.
Has such a huge amount of information in it that we can use that as a tool to customize to the learning style of the kid and still stay within that standardized scenario.
So I'm speaking about some things that we have today and some things that the product will have very, very soon.
Um, it's in the lab, so to speak, this, this artificial intelligence component, but.
To answer your question in a shorter way, that's that that element of customization and standardization is the line that we have to walk every day.
And the only way to do that is to get it in front of educators as we've done and get feedback and see how, how it's going, how it's being used, and then just continuously go down that path to see what's working.
And I, I think that's important too, especially as an educator who has been on both sides.
You know who I, I got my PhD, so I saw the academia and the research side, and I understand that, and that's what I love about voice is that it is so grounded in research because we do need that.
But a lot of times I saw a big disconnect between the researchers.
And developers of products, and then especially in ed tech and then the actual classroom educators and what we need and how we need it to work and things like that.
You know, so you're, you practice with a student, you know, saying hi to a kid and they finally say hi to a kid in the hallway and instead of saying hi back, the kid just gives them a head nod.
And so then it's like, we, well, we didn't practice that.
Like, so what are, you know, and so having.
The ability to be able to meet the needs so that it is usable.
It's not just going through this and, and, you know, a checklist.
Oh, they can, you know, do five greetings, you know, whatever.
And, and so having that practical user experience and data that you're talking about, I think is, is very important.
And so with that, are you seeing that there's certain areas that, uh, that educators are using it more?
Is it really focusing on the social, is it.
You know, more of the practical, like how to order a meal, things like that.
Where are you seeing it kind of being used out?
I, I don't wanna say the real world, 'cause like, you know, academia is the real world, but outside of academia, nobody usually cares how many peer reviewed journal articles you have.
So, um, I always say we need both and we need to understand both.
But, um, you know, in, in, in the actual, uh, application of this product.
Yeah.
A lot of the scenarios right now visually speaking are set in traditional public school settings.
Um, the gymnasium, the lunch room of a school, classrooms.
Um, and this is just sort of where it started.
Um, voice also has.
A really robust generalization component.
By that I mean, um, there's a, a separate product developed by the researchers.
Um, I call it a product.
It's, it's really a sort of a, almost a curriculum, um, and a set of tools to help teachers, parents, whoever is, uh, administering this.
Tool to generalize whatever the skill is to real life.
Um, and there are all sorts of different ways to do that.
Generalization can be taking the skill in one scenario and applying it to a different scenario.
Um, it can be relating the, what you're talking about, the, Hey, what's up versus the head nod.
Um.
That sort of illuminates another point that about voice, which is this was never intended to be a video game where we want to suck kids into it and have them spend most of their day there.
Um, and this is another thing that's drew me to this project, um, compared to others, is that this is an environment to train you for real world interactions.
Yeah, and it's designed just to give you enough sort of cycles or rehearsal, if you will, to then be ready to enter the real world and actually practice the skill.
So generalizing these skills.
Figuring out how much, you know, do we need to represent this skill in a different environment For some kids, probably do.
For some kids they can say, okay, I get it.
If it's in the lunchroom, I can do it in the grocery store also.
Um, and just figuring that out.
Um.
As we go along, as we get more and more people using it, more and more data about, uh, what's happening.
And then also anecdotes, you know, teachers are, they don't need to be present necessarily for you to play voice or for a kid to play voice.
Um, but they have.
They have a tool that allows them to monitor what's going on.
Um, and that's different than some of the other systems out there where you need a person live and available at that moment.
This can be a, an asynchronous, you know, this kid is playing this scenario that another kid's playing this scenario.
It's much more scalable in that way.
You can have kids progressing at different paces, which is part of the customization question that you asked.
Um, and we can.
We can start to see what sort of generalization, where we need to extend it.
Um, you know, you, we, I will be the first to tell you we don't have every single thing figured out with this product and how kids learn.
Um, I'd like to meet the person who does because we have a lot of questions for them.
Um,
too.
but.
It's an iterative process in that way.
And we have a really big headstart is what I like to say, on what to look for.
We've got researchers, educators, um, former and current looking at this thing, um, saying this is where, you know, we're in the classroom every, every day or we're studying the research every day and we need to see, um.
How this intersects with what's actually happening.
Um, supercharge it so that when we get it out there, every new version is going to move forward much further than we were before.
I like that.
So if I'm hearing what you're saying correctly, if I'm an educator and I'm going to use voice, it will allow me to set a student up in a certain social situation or communication situation and allow them to practice and I don't have to be there to.
Guide them or to run anything.
And so then that might allow me to work with another student and then I come back to that student and you know, review what they did and things like that.
So it's kind of like giving me an extra, almost.
Teacher or, or, or, um, you know, communication partner.
Yeah, we're, we're pulling the Michael Keaton and, uh, doing a little multiplicity throwback movie for anybody that's listening.
Not his best.
I, I, I, I love, he's still my favorite Batman.
But, um,
by far
yeah, absolutely.
Uh, anyways, um.
everyone go back and watch the originals
Yes, the OG original Batman, and I like Christian Bale, don't get me wrong, but Michael Keaton's the best.
Um, but, uh, yeah, so that's, uh, going to be able to help me and, and also.
Part of the reason that I think people, kid, uh, in general people struggle with communication is there's not always those communication exchanges like they have to come up naturally unless we as educators can facilitate them.
So this allows for more practice and more exchanges.
Then maybe I would even be able to facilitate in a, a regular everyday, uh, class school day is what you're telling me.
Yeah, absolutely.
I mean it, uh, it.
It's intuitive to me just from having trained as a musician because you just have iterations or constant cycles.
You have to go through something a few times before it becomes recognizable to you in the context of a performance, which is.
A good sort of comparison to what we're talking about.
Um, we're all performing in public social skills.
Many of them we take for granted.
We have many of, many of them have become automatic for us.
Um, but of course people who haven't learned these yet, younger kids who've never been exposed to this before, this kind of rehearsal can make a huge difference.
Um.
You know, and part of it's confidence, part of it's just, oh, I've, I've, I've done this before.
I now recognize this.
So I'm not distracted by the nerves that I feel just enough to interact in the situation and accomplish, you know, talk to the police officer about this.
Um.
About the situation.
Um, recognize when it's dangerous or not.
Uh, you know, talk to kids who are trying to, uh, take advantage of me somehow.
You know, recognize that situation, not be distracted by the nerves you feel and get through it.
And it's so important.
I think, you know, we, especially during COVID and everything, we learned that communication and, and, and.
And people are just so important to everybody's mental health.
And so everybody, uh, needs that connection with others.
And when you do have some sort of communication struggle, it, it, it can be very isolating.
And so as somebody who taught a lot of nonverbal students who were not deaf as, um, and so I I, is there any type of, um, input or.
How would I as a nonverbal student be able to use voice to practice my communication skills?
So we have a couple of different versions.
Like I said, one of the, one of the important aspects of voice is we don't care about the platform necessarily.
We want it to be.
Available to people in, as available as possible, um, in many different modalities, devices, whatever it may be.
Um, and so we have right now voice, if you go and you play the beta version that's live in the app stores right now, um.
You can download the app and you'll get a lot, you'll get, uh, written choices.
You'll get audio talking to you.
Um, there's not a requirement that you, there's not a microphone component right now.
That's what we have in the lab right now.
That will be the next version of voice.
Um.
But, so answer to your question.
Students read responses.
They listen to the situation, they observe, they can take time to look at the available options, and they choose from multiple choice questions, uh, multiple choice answers.
Um, and so this, you know.
Students who are nonverbal can still go through this.
Um, in fact, the ver the verbal, the part that we're working through right now is the AI component where you have more of a natural interaction with speech, um, where the student is speaking and having an LLM based character respond.
Um, so, and, and we wanna keep those versions available so that we have, um.
Students that have different needs, and we can address those as much as we can.
Um, and that's part of the business game, so to speak, is, you know, we need to, we need to address the needs of these kids and these kids.
You know, where do we put our energy?
Um, how do we scale this scenario?
So we're making it as available to as many kids as we can.
And I think that's one of the things that resonated with me when I was learning about voice and, and what the whole project actually even kind of is.
'cause it's even a little bit more than just voice.
Um, and with the I know platform and everything is that it really did come from this place of wanting to help and wanting to get this out there to as many people as possible to benefit.
And of course, we all know in order to help more people, you gotta keep the lights on and that's.
You know what I'm trying to do too, so I get that aspect of it, but you can tell when it comes from a position of wanting to help versus just wanting sales.
And I, I love that.
That's been one of the, the major, um, components and, and that voice is grounded in that.
So as you guys do expand and, and try to reach more people, you know, um, you mentioned, uh, that.
You mentioned the website and um, I also wanted to highlight that it is available now on any device for people on either, um, app store.
Is that correct?
Yeah, Google Play Store, apple App Store, and we can side load it onto VR headsets.
Since we've done that a couple of times or several times actually.
Nice.
I wanted to make sure I highlighted that.
Uh, again.
And so if there was one feature that you.
Found from voice that you're like, you know what, this is really, you know, this is it.
This is, this is the banger, as they say, as the kids say, what I, what would be something that you would highlight specifically that voice offers?
Um, I think.
I think the advantage that voice has that
other platforms that are similar do not, is that it's that it's platform agnostic, that it can be delivered over so many different, um, devices and platforms.
And it's, it's really the combination.
Um,
it's the combination of.
Realizing taking the skill and, and quickly spinning up a scenario that encapsulates that skill.
Um, so it's really the intelligence that's built into the platform that's the core feature or the core advantage, um, from a business perspective.
Um, mentioned before, lots, many years of research have gone into this.
Um, it's, it's surprisingly difficult to say, oh, I've got an idea for a behavior or a skill, and then figure out where it goes, uh, how best to represent
it visually, and then also how to track what's happening, um, and tracking, you know, we, we can say they've played this scenario this many times.
Um, we're looking at the time it takes to answer the question.
Um.
It's just kind of the combination of all of those things in a package that can be delivered on any device, um, with the years of research behind it.
So it, it's, it's kind of the full package, of course, I would say that, but it's, it's everything is my favorite part.
And that's okay.
That, that, that's absolutely okay.
No shame in that.
And, uh, so kinda one last question just about in general, like the platform and, and I know you mentioned AI and obviously that's the big buzzwords everybody's talking about
and stuff, but is this platform something where you guys as the like administrators of the platform come out with different scenarios or will I have the ability to kind of.
Create some of my own, like Halloween is coming up, you know, like if I, I, my favorite thing I miss in the classroom is I used to go to the UPS store and get one of
those huge, like wardrobe boxes and we would cut a square out and, you know, we'd paint it and we'd make it a house and my kids would actually practice trick or treating.
'cause that was a big skill for them.
And so like is there an, like, if I'm a user of voice, do I have the ability to create that scenario in there?
Or is that something that would have to come from like the voice team down?
So right now that has to come from the device developers and product people.
Um, that being said.
These ideas come from the educators who have used it in the many pilots that we've done.
And so it's always, you know, in my previous company, we would go talk to the customers, the end users, see how they're using it, see what they thought of it, and then they would come to us with ideas and be like, great, great.
Yeah, let's do that.
Great.
Um, immediately, we'll, we'll spin it up as fast as we can and release it the next week.
If anyone who's spent any time as a product manager or developing products realizes that okay, they don't understand the entire platform.
We can't simply just take every suggestion and turn it into a new feature, but there's, there's almost always something there that they're reacting to.
And then it's our job as the product team, the development team to say, okay, we'll take that skill's actually already here.
If we change it in this way, it will be more relatable in the way that they're talking about.
So right now the product team is at, voice, is in charge of creating those, spinning those up.
We are getting a lot of ideas from the educators who are using it, and we've talked about having different ways where we can make that much faster.
Ultimately, that loop we could envision someday where you, you need a particular scenario, you need to teach, trick or treating.
Um, we can provide you with the tools to change the scenario so it fits your group or your child, your child better.
Um.
We haven't worked out all of those details yet, but you can see with some of the advances that are coming with ai, the way these things are quickly spun up, um, you can quickly interact with them.
We're heading in that direction, so we're already looking down that road.
Nice.
And I think that's important.
What you said is very important, and I hope people hear that because everybody thinks, oh, well just do it with ai.
Oh, now with ai.
And it's like, well, it's not that.
Simple yet, like we're getting there and things like that.
But it's not like people think it is.
And so it does take time.
And I, and I think especially when you're looking at a, an environment like a virtual environment that is now a th.
360 immersive environment, whether it's delivered on a, a tablet or on a headset, it doesn't matter.
But now you're having to create all of these other things in other worlds.
You know, like if it's just 2D, you don't have to worry about the back of the person or all that kinda stuff.
Now you have to do everything.
So it's a lot more, uh, uh, you know, taxing than what people think and just assume, oh, well you can just create this.
Like, yeah, if I could, I would.
So I think that was an important distinction, and I'm glad that you, you mentioned that.
Well, and that's, that's part of the product.
I mean, that's why it's valuable because the AI companies, the, the media, everyone, lots of people will tell you how easy it is to do everything with ai.
Now, um.
Sort of maybe so, but it's, it's our job to make, to translate that and use those tools to make them available to you.
'cause AI is many different things.
It still requires tools, it still requires an understanding of how it works.
And we handle that part, you know, we, we make it useful.
Um, and that's the job that every product company has, I believe, to.
If they're going to provide something that's actually valuable, um, you know, we need, we need to put a little more effort into it and create the functions and features that allow you as a consumer to do that.
Well said.
Thank you Paul.
As we're kind of wrapping up here, is there anything that you, uh, that we didn't get to talk about that you wanted to mention?
I know obviously everybody's supposed to smash that like button or whatever on the podcast.
Um, and I'm gonna put all the links and everything, um, and.
You know, in with the podcast and we know, uh, available on the App store website.
Anything else that you wanted to, to just make sure that everybody knew or you know, how they, they wanted, if they were interested in voice, what should they do?
Where should they go?
Um, yeah.
Easiest way is voice.org, VOIS s.org.
Um.
We would, we would really like to hear from you if you have questions.
As I said before, this started as a research project.
We're trying to get it out to the public.
We're trying to see, we want feedback.
Um.
In in business, you'll hear over and over again.
Well, if you want to know what your customers want or need, you just go ask them.
It's surprisingly hard to get that kind of valuable feedback because people are busy and if you give them a product that's not perfect,
they may not have the imagination to imagine how it is better, or they may not have the time to go through that process at all.
So get in touch with us.
There's a contact form there.
Um, we're on most, most of the social channels as well.
Everything, if you just go to voice.org can find us on the website.
We would love to hear from you.
Um, we wanna learn about as many situations as we can.
You know, I'm a parent, I have a homeschool group.
I'm at a public school.
I have a private school.
I'm a therapist.
I'm a, I have a private practice.
I can see this being used for x. Um.
We're collecting all of that because we wanna make this available to as many people.
So please get in touch, touch with us and um, you know, we will respond as quickly as we can.
And I can attest to that.
They're very responsive, so I I appreciate that.
That's, that's good to know because a lot of times, you know, you reach out to these companies and, and then you don't hear anything back, and you're like, all right, well forget it, and you move on.
So it, it's good to know that people actually are there and, and that you do want that feedback.
And for the, you know, having been part of an early stage company before, as you become a much larger company, you don't have time to respond to every inquiry or you start putting an AI in front of it, which sometimes works, sometimes doesn't.
As a small company, you know, you are everything to your first few customers.
So if you want to get in early, contact us and 'cause we'll have a much.
Just as, as business goes, we'll have a much better, more contact relationship early on, um, than when this becomes a billion dollar company.
Right,
Although we won't try to lose that.
I'm just saying it.
Other companies, we may be the first who doesn't lose that connection, but
absolutely.
Better not.
That's
just in case.
Yeah, exactly.
I love it.
All right.
Well, Paul, this has been absolutely wonderful.
I thank you so much for joining us.
Um, it is always great to hear about what's out there and what's available, and, um, if anybody, you know, listening does.
Wanna reach out to me as well.
Um, you know, I'm kind of helping with voice and so I will, if nothing else, I can get you in contact with the right people.
But, um, I, I am a fan and I love what you guys are doing, so I'm happy to help in any way.
And I know you didn't think you were getting out here without the closing countdown.
Paul has courageously, uh, said that he would be willing to have it be a surprise and, um, I had a different.
Uh, topic that I was gonna do, 'cause I want it to be something that nobody's ever asked you before, but since you had mentioned everything about music and you
went to school for it and things like that, I feel like I have to go with the, if you could only listen to three songs, not albums, not artists, just three songs.
Now that can be like an overture or something.
Like if, if you're into, into classical or whatever, but you could only listen to three for the rest of your life and that's it.
What would they be?
Hmm.
Well that's a really good one.
Um, I mean, I. My, my first degree was in essentially classical music.
Um,
and I'm gonna cheat a little bit to say The Planets by Gustav Holst is an orchestral suite.
It's actually, you know, songs.
Um,
I will allow it.
okay.
So that's number one.
It's some of the best orchestral writing I've ever heard.
Um.
check it out.
Next one would be, uh, in the jazz idiom.
I would have to say
probably Night Train by Oscar Peterson.
Okay.
He was jazz pianist.
Um, just phenomenal.
You won't be, you won't regret going to find Night, train, train.
A lot of ska or like
This is just instrumental piano.
He did have a lot of collaborations with Ella Fitzgerald and other singers, but, um, just, uh, unbelievable pianist and swings, swings so hard.
And number three, oh my goodness.
I mean.
I, I grew up in the nineties, uh, Dave Matthews Band Ants marching.
I just got stuck on that one as I tend to do with this or that song.
And you won't find anyone else, uh, Shannon, who will give you those three in the entire world so
I guarantee you that a hundred percent.
I agree.
I now have some new music I need to check out.
Um, 'cause any of classical music that I know, uh, is because I've seen it on original Frazier and, um, that's pretty much my extent.
Um, so I'm gonna have to check that one out.
Sounds very interesting.
I'm typically not a big jazz fan.
But I will, I'm willing to give it a listen and especially 'cause it's instrumental and I appreciate talent, so I like that.
And yeah.
Dave Matthews, I thought you were gonna go like satellite.
I wasn't sure, but, uh, uh, inspired.
That's a good, that's a good one.
Um, and
Dave Matthews Band.
For those of you who weren't around were they had a, they were a rock band, but had a violin.
And a saxophone.
I think they've added a trumpet and maybe some other stuff now,
Yeah, they were kinda like groundbreaking with that, right.
DMB baby.
I mean, I guarantee you there's some kid out there wearing a Dave Matthews band shirt right now and has no idea what, I've never even heard a song by him and they need to check it out, so.
Yep.
Absolutely.
Well, Paul, that's been awesome.
I even learned a lot.
Um.
Especially in, in the music category, but, uh, through everything you were saying.
So thank you so much.
It's been fabulous and, uh, I look forward to hopefully working with you some more and, uh, just watching how voice grows and all the, the great work you guys are gonna be able to do.
You bet.
And, um, if you wanna get in touch with me directly, I, I've been working with voice for a year now.
Um, I, I also have other projects and things that I've worked on in the past.
Paul ep tech.com.
P-A-U-L-E-P-P-T-E-C h.com.
Um, you can see some of my other stuff and get in touch with me there if you want.
Not j not just about Dave Matthews band, but also about Dave Matthews Band.
Well now I'm definitely checking it out.
Thank you again.
Thanks Paul so much.
Thanks for having me.